Curse

Quaker · Dec 12, 2007, 04:07 PM // 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Online Gamer

SO I have been looking around at MM builds but every time some says flesh golem in it a bunch of people say no get rid of it and get something usefull

WHY DOES EVERY ONE HATE FLESH GOLEM IT IS ONE OF THE STRONGER CREATURES IN THE GAME!!!!

Well, you know how it is with kids. Whatever they like or think is "kewl" is the best thing - anything that they don't like is "junk". The truth of the matter is that there are pros & cons to using Flesh Golem - many of which have been mentioned here - and in the long run the differences are minor.
But you see, dissing Flesh Golem is one of those "leet" things that players spout off. It has more to do with being "kewl" or "leet" than the relative merits of it.
More meaningless myths:
Sundering is useless.
Rangers don't do damage.
Assassins are fragile.
Melee fighters have to have IAS.

Etc., etc. - the list goes on. If you find someone giving you advice that spouts off any of these "rulz", find someone else with a more balanced opinion.

Xylia · Dec 12, 2007, 05:53 PM // 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rexion

i hope the OP isnt serious.... caps lock? turns people off, even during the mating season.

the three basic MM builds are:
minion spammers (have like 4 minion-typed skills, a heal area, heal minions, and rez)
minion bomber (has a flesh golem and a bunch of horrors, when they die they cause disease)
*NEWEST BUILD THAT I JUST FOUND* SS necro with a bunch of horrors/vampiric. that one is teh sexorz -- turns people back on after your caps lock.

I never use flesh golem on a bomber build...that makes little sense, since you can't blow it up.

I will use it on a true minion master build (what you're referring to as a 'minion spammer' above) because of the recyclable corpse and because it is significantly more durable than the other meatshields. I would not recommend it in Hard Mode, as it no longer has the level advantage against most monsters.

It really depends on what you want. If you want pure damage, I wouldn't bring flesh golem. If you are more interested in body blocking and distracting enemies, then flesh golem may be right for you. If you are in an area that has enough corpses to support an army, but not much more, it is useful to have the recyclable corpse from the flesh golem, although not bringing an MM or bringing a bomber with bone minions is often better in these situations.

Heroes use Flesh Golem very poorly - if you're not playing the MM yourself, I would recommend bringing some other elite (probably jagged bones)

Quote:

Originally Posted by N E D M

Dont rule out this : [skill]tainted flesh[/skill]

I use on MM occasionally - might work out better on a hero tho

EDIT: That is one muscular skeleton in the skill icon, lol

Heroes are excellent with tainted flesh if you give them the chance to cast it on everyone.

Online Gamer · Dec 12, 2007, 09:01 PM // 21:01

I donty really under stand though about aura of lich... It cuts ur healt in half so when you have like 480 or whatever you go down to 240... but then it cuts all damage in half(which can be good) but when you spam Botm it will do same ratio of damage....

cgruber · Dec 12, 2007, 09:08 PM // 21:08

Combine it with healing breeze or mending and you will have a tough little necro. Or protective spirit and a low health build if you want to try a pseudo 55 style build.

BladeDVD · Dec 12, 2007, 09:22 PM // 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Online Gamer

I donty really under stand though about aura of lich... It cuts ur healt in half so when you have like 480 or whatever you go down to 240... but then it cuts all damage in half(which can be good) but when you spam Botm it will do same ratio of damage....

First of all, the same ratio of damage ignores the fact that the actual sacrifice number is lower. BotM (with 10 minions up) would sacrifice 120pts at 480 health, vs. 60pts at 240 health, that's pretty helpful right there (similar to the way a 55 build works).

But Aura of the Lich halves damage from all sources including life sacrifice, so it, in effect, quarters the damage received from Blood of the Master, and continuing my example above, would result in a 30pt hit at 240 health.

I believe the only thing not affected by AotL is degen. Great skill, especially if you are running with multiple MMs.

I personally prefer Order of Undeath, but need to try that Jagged Bones build for the MM hero. Flesh Golem is not bad so much as there are better elites to take than it.

Pyro maniac · Dec 12, 2007, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giga Strike

did aura of the lich used to cut healing in half?

yes, september 29. 2005

Quote:

Aura of the Lich - Decreased Energy to 10; decreased casting time to 2 seconds; decreased recharge to 20; decreased duration to 15..45; removed “half healing” from description.

Coloneh · Dec 13, 2007, 04:12 AM // 04:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

Yarrr! I got tempbanned twice.

Once for utterly obvious sarcasm, I was even helping the guy!

And the second time for again, sarcasm/trolling/pure irony but I don't quite remember what thread....oh yeah...it was a freekedoutfish's thread... "<something> isn't fun". My reply: Anal probing isn't fun either!

they tell you why they ban you? lucky! ive been banned 4 or 5 times, they havent given me a reason yet.

HawkofStorms · Dec 13, 2007, 04:52 AM // 04:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by BladeDVD

First of all, the same ratio of damage ignores the fact that the actual sacrifice number is lower. BotM (with 10 minions up) would sacrifice 120pts at 480 health, vs. 60pts at 240 health, that's pretty helpful right there (similar to the way a 55 build works).

But Aura of the Lich halves damage from all sources including life sacrifice, so it, in effect, quarters the damage received from Blood of the Master, and continuing my example above, would result in a 30pt hit at 240 health.

I believe the only thing not affected by AotL is degen. Great skill, especially if you are running with multiple MMs.

I personally prefer Order of Undeath, but need to try that Jagged Bones build for the MM hero. Flesh Golem is not bad so much as there are better elites to take than it.

Minor point. I'm pretty sure AotL doesn't halve life stealing attacks.

arsie · Dec 13, 2007, 05:05 AM // 05:05

AotL has the same pros and cons of 55ing right?

BigDave · Dec 13, 2007, 06:05 AM // 06:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by arsie

AotL has the same pros and cons of 55ing right?

Not to the same extent but yes. Degen and life steal will cut right through AotL and so hit you twice as hard, but with an AotL MM really you should be using health regen as your self heal (mystic regen, healing breeze, etc...) so the only thing that will really hit you hard is life stealing and there isn't a whole lot of that in the game. With AotL up you'll probably have around 200-250hp so getting hit with life steal or heavy degen won't affect you anything like as much as it would a 55.

Other than that AotL can make you very hard to kill indeed. Ever tried taking down a MM in AB who's running AotL, Dark Bond, Infuse Condition and Mystic Regen with direct damage? Let me tell you, if they have more than a couple of minions up you'll be there for a long time. And if they have a full army they can take the damage from 2 sins and an ele for a good length of time before going down. You'll have to kill every minion they have before the MM will go down, unless the damage you put down on them is truly colossal.

One of the drawbacks that 55's have which an AotL build doesn't have is that you're not as vunerable to enchant stripping. If you do get stripped you'll still have a normal health range (like 450-500hp). If a 55 gets stripped/interupted they're screwed, lol.

BladeDVD · Dec 14, 2007, 08:42 AM // 08:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkofStorms

Minor point. I'm pretty sure AotL doesn't halve life stealing attacks.

Yes, you are correct. Life steal and degen are not affected by AotL. In my defense I did say "I believe."

BenjZee · Dec 14, 2007, 11:33 AM // 11:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curse You

I prefer to Jagged Bones on my heroes, simply because I always notice how bad the heroes can be with Animate Flesh Golem. They don't wait for their existing Golem to die before re-using the skill and so waste the free corpse.

but then again the other flesh golem will leave a corpse. Meaning you could make the same amount of minions but with extra time and health on them

Rathcail · Dec 14, 2007, 01:35 PM // 13:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmithyBen

but then again the other flesh golem will leave a corpse. Meaning you could make the same amount of minions but with extra time and health on them

If you animate a flesh golem when you already have one, the old golem dies off and leaves already exploited corpse.
That's why it's bad when the heroes won't wait for the first golem to die off before making a new one.

quickmonty · Dec 14, 2007, 02:00 PM // 14:00

I do that myself sometimes as MM, if there are enough corpses to use. You get a nice fresh Fleshy with full health bar.

freekedoutfish · Dec 14, 2007, 02:19 PM // 14:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Online Gamer

SO I have been looking around at MM builds but every time some says flesh golem in it a bunch of people say no geth rid of it and get something use full

WHY DOES EVERY ONE HATE FLESH GOLEM IT IS ONE OF THE STRONGER CREATURES IN THE GAME!!!!

I've actually seen the opposite. I run an MM build in AB called pvp death reaper and when ever I have flesh golem in my skill bar I get "nice you have flesh golem".

But in all honesty, the only advantage to FG is its stronger then other minions and seems to do more damage and it leaves a corpse behind.

When you weight that up compared to other skills you could use, its not that great, so it is a bit over rated. Any minion other then the bog standard ones are good for a fight. A mix of range attacking, vampiric and bleeding minions is always good (sorry dont know the exact names).

I went onto pvxwiki and found a great MM build which uses alot of enchantments to protect against harm and it doesnt use flesh golem.

Check out http://www.pvxwiki.com/wiki/Build:N/..._to_the_Master

It works pretty well aslong as you maintain enchantments.

Quaker · Dec 14, 2007, 07:23 PM // 19:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

But in all honesty, the only advantage to FG is its stronger then other minions and seems to do more damage and it leaves a corpse behind.

That's actually a pretty good advantage, depending upon what you want an MM to do. When I'm running my H&H mini-b/p group, the minions mostly function as "blockers", so the longer they last, the better. Their damage output is of secondary importance, and Bone Fiends (ranged attack) and Bone Minions are not used.

Online Gamer · Dec 15, 2007, 06:40 PM // 18:40

[skill]Aura of the Lich[/skill] guess it is okay, ill use it if i dont get factions

El toro loco · Dec 16, 2007, 03:38 AM // 03:38

Flesh Golems hit hard but r very slow to attack it depends what your going for tho :P

Nodensis · Dec 16, 2007, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

That's actually a pretty good advantage, depending upon what you want an MM to do. When I'm running my H&H mini-b/p group, the minions mostly function as "blockers", so the longer they last, the better. Their damage output is of secondary importance, and Bone Fiends (ranged attack) and Bone Minions are not used.

I think you hit the spot there, the difference is if you want them to be aggro-takers or damage-dealing.

Aggro takes: Flesh Golem and Bone Horror's
Damage dealers: JB/minions/nova, OoU/vampirics... etc etc

My answer on original question: Flesh Golem isn't dead, but pro teams work on precision and MM are out-ranked these days (especially since last b/p nerf).

Online Gamer · Dec 16, 2007, 12:05 PM // 12:05

Awww man I like being MM i am good at it aswell